Topic: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

Hi to you all.
I'm new here and I'm from The Netherlands (forgive me my English writing)

I'm playing around with some of the available Strategy Builders.
Have been testing with StrategyQuant for a couple of days and now with FSB.
One thing I noticed (sure there are more things) is that FSB is coming with a new strategy in a matter of minutes while SQ can run for days or weeks.
Is FSB so fast or SQ so slow or am I comparing "apples with peers"?

What makes FSB better than the others.
I really like the fresh, modern and logic setup of FSB.
Most others are a little bit outdated or complex.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

As you know, I'm the FSB Pro author and my opinion is highly subjective, so better ask in some forum for a neutral opinion.

Both programs are valuable but different.

Strategy Quant is mainly used for creating a set of strategies automatically. You just run it and after two days you have strategies. It is designed to produce good backtest result without paying attention on the strategy logic. SQ may create a strategy that trades when MACD is higher than RSI for example. It is a little bit like comparing apples with oranges.

I can tell you more for FSB of course.
We invented the strategy Generator at 2004, the backtesting interpolation methods, the Method Comparator, the Ambiguous bars and other.

FSB was free and open source until 2014.

The purpose of FSB is to provide tools for creating a logically correct strategy and to present all aspects of the backtest to the trader. The FSB users can create complex strategies manually. FSB provides possibility to set individual symbol and data period for each indicator. It provides signals shift and signal repeat functions, which gives possibility of creating complex signals. There are also logical groups.

FSB has Bar Explorer tool that shows all executed and cancelled orders and positions in data tables and graphs. This is the only way to understand how the backtest works.

The SQ price is high because they give 50% for advertising and commissions to partners.
We do not advertise FSB and all you pay is for the internal product value. Even more, for the price of SQ you can take one of ours Optimal Packs, which includes a lifetime FSB Pro for two machines, a lifetime account for EA Studio, and one year account for BO Tester.

By the way, EA Studio is design to cover all positive sides of SQ and even better – it comes with a Strategy Reactor.

As final words, SQ is better if you want a bunch of strategies and don't care how they trade.
FSB is better if you want to create logically correct strategies and want to understand how the automatic trading works.

A great part of the users that contact me are Strategy Quant owners, so probably the best for you is to purchase SQ now and later to come back for a Forex Pack with FSB pro and EA Studio.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I am a People, that have before purchase StrategyQuant.

And later i have buy FSB Pro. FSB is much better and comfortabler then SQ.

It is not easy, i have Little Problems, but i think Mr. Popov can help me.

Marcus

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I have used both.
Strategy Quant sits idle while I run FSBPRO almost 24/7.

I find FSBPro much simpler and faster to get results, I have built a substantial portfolio using FSBPro over a few years.

Building automated trading systems does not have to be as complex as Strategy Quant.

It is a matter of personal preference, I have found the developer of FSBPro to be quick to deal with problems and that is what matters to me as well as ease of generating and testing strategies.

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

Thanks for the answers.
Yes, FSB is much simpler than QR. Agree.
And support is much better.
Forum is much more active.

For now I really like FSB much more then SQ.
Not only the price (LOL), it's the way it is setup

I have a dir on my computer with 50+ bought EA's which are all been weighted too light.
Now it's time for something new.

But there is one thing missing to get me over the line:
Proof of good created FSB strategies shown on a MyFXbook verified account.
It's like sellers of an EA who show me a beautiful picture of a backtest but can't show me live verified accounts.
Are there any links to accounts running on FSB created strategies?

Blaiserboy: can you show me something of your portfolio?

Whats the best way to get a substantial portfolio of good working EA?

Sorry for all the questions but I want to buy the right package.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

It's like sellers of an EA who show me a beautiful picture of a backtest but can't show me live verified accounts.

Watch my video series and you will see how we create experts and make profit.

Whats the best way to get a substantial portfolio of good working EA?

Take one of our forex packs and practice two years. We guarantee that you will improve your trading skills and performance.
The EA Studio's Reactor is also a good start.

Please note also that the Mega Pack includes a personal training, which may help you a lot.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

Popov wrote:

Please note also that the Mega Pack includes a personal training, which may help you a lot.

Hello Mr. Popov. I have buyed the Optimal Pack. I dont have thinking over personal Training.

Can you explain me, what that is? I mean what you make with that and in what for a time?

Thank you, Marcus

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I do not think anyone is going to attempt to prove anything and I don't think anyone is going to open a MyFxBook account to get an audience.
My FxBook is for people who want to sell things such as experts or signal services.
I am not interested 9in selling anything.
FSBPro sells itself.
What I suggest that you do is....... construct a stratgey, do the testing and then do a thorough walk forward using the 'Data Horizon' under 'Market' at the top of the screen, You can manipulate the dates any way you want and see about the strategy that you have devised.
There is nothing that my experts can do for you and no matter what you see, you are going to have to make your own decisions.
I would not want that you base a decision on seeing my strategies...... you have to make the decision on your own, doing your own due diligence.

I use FSBPro because I like it and I like the people in this forum and I like how Popov deals with the problems...... you may not like any of those....

Your decision will cost you some good amount of money, I do not want you to make a wrong decision....... that decision you will have to do yourself to meet your own personal requirements.

A few years ago I was after Popov to make a fancy sales page..... I could not understand why he refused. Well, finally I realized that the product will sell itself toi the people who want what it provides.

I can suggest that you make a list of the features of the software and then  for each of the features make a list of the benefits that you can see and also a list of the problems... that will lay out clealry where you should go.

This is a decision that you have to live with for a long time....... and, unfortunately, it is up to you, not up to anyone showing you results.

If you have time, you can look back through old posts on the forum and learn what others have experienced.

You might see that some very capable traders are using the software for themselves and for their clients.

From snooping around on the net I have seen that a couple users are now providing signal services for a fee.

Some people will not succeed using FSBPro because they will not take the time to master its capabilities. Some people will fail because they do not perform all of the tests on their strategies before live trading.

Myself, I am experimenting all day and most evenings....... I try all sorts of things... just to see what happens. Slowly I learn.

And if you are going to be developing automated systems. you will have to do the same. You have to ask yourself if this work is what you want. As far as making a choice of software. they both offer solutions and they can both offer frustrations.

The choice is your to make.

daveM

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

Blaiserboy wrote:

I do not think anyone is going to attempt to prove anything and I don't think anyone is going to open a MyFxBook account to get an audience.
My FxBook is for people who want to sell things such as experts or signal services.
I am not interested 9in selling anything.
FSBPro sells itself.
What I suggest that you do is....... construct a stratgey, do the testing and then do a thorough walk forward using the 'Data Horizon' under 'Market' at the top of the screen, You can manipulate the dates any way you want and see about the strategy that you have devised.
There is nothing that my experts can do for you and no matter what you see, you are going to have to make your own decisions.
I would not want that you base a decision on seeing my strategies...... you have to make the decision on your own, doing your own due diligence.

I use FSBPro because I like it and I like the people in this forum and I like how Popov deals with the problems...... you may not like any of those....

Your decision will cost you some good amount of money, I do not want you to make a wrong decision....... that decision you will have to do yourself to meet your own personal requirements.

A few years ago I was after Popov to make a fancy sales page..... I could not understand why he refused. Well, finally I realized that the product will sell itself toi the people who want what it provides.

I can suggest that you make a list of the features of the software and then  for each of the features make a list of the benefits that you can see and also a list of the problems... that will lay out clealry where you should go.

This is a decision that you have to live with for a long time....... and, unfortunately, it is up to you, not up to anyone showing you results.

If you have time, you can look back through old posts on the forum and learn what others have experienced.

You might see that some very capable traders are using the software for themselves and for their clients.

From snooping around on the net I have seen that a couple users are now providing signal services for a fee.

Some people will not succeed using FSBPro because they will not take the time to master its capabilities. Some people will fail because they do not perform all of the tests on their strategies before live trading.

Myself, I am experimenting all day and most evenings....... I try all sorts of things... just to see what happens. Slowly I learn.

And if you are going to be developing automated systems. you will have to do the same. You have to ask yourself if this work is what you want. As far as making a choice of software. they both offer solutions and they can both offer frustrations.

The choice is your to make.

daveM

Thanks Dave!
I know that with my questions I could expect an answer like yours.
And you're probably right with your answers.

Yes, it's my decision.No problem with that.
Yes, I'm seriously working with Forex.
Yes, I earn money with it each month.
Yes, I have my own MyFxbook although I don't sell anything.
It's just easy to have an overview of most of my accounts and strategies.
Yes, I will buy FSB and start my own learning curve.
Talk soon on one of the other topics in the forum.
When interested you can see my portfolie here: http://www.myfxbook.com/members/forexdutchie

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

One other thing that's not yet clear for me.
When/why should I use FSBpro and when/why EA Studio?
Both do the same thing (as far as I can see).

In other words: when I buy FSBPro what are the benefits of buying EA Studio too?

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

EA Studio is a different tool in that it is running on the cloud and much faster, you can run as many versions as you want.

It does some of the testing as part of its routine..... ie optimizing and monte carlo

You can , when looking at individual results, add and remove indicators and optimize those and do the monte carlo seperately.

Best to spend a few hours working with it and checking the featires yourself.

There are quite a few differences between it and FSBPro......  try it for a few hours!

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

One substantial difference between our policy and the policy of the StrategyQuant authors:

SQ: We do not offer refunds, therefore take advantage of the free trial

FSB Pro: 30 days 100% money back guarantee. No questions asked

13 (edited by geektrader 2018-03-25 11:09:46)

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I have to say that I am long-term SQ user as well and have been beta-testing the upcoming version 4 for a long time too (and reported tons of bugs). To make it short: once EA Studio gets the "correct" stability measure for the systems equity curves that I am looking for, I think I do not need SQ 4 anymore for the moment because EA Studio / FSB Pro give me an (almost) perfect combination. The only things I am really missing are the custom fitness formulas / weighted optimization goals that SQ / Adaptrade Builder / the new GSB offer. E.g.: instead of just optimizing for simple goals like Net Profit or Return / Drawdown like FSB Pro / EA Studio do it, I use custom weights to combine different goals (e.g. 0.5 weight on net profit, 0.7 weight on stability of the curve, 0.3 on return/dd) and it´s an integral part of my strategy generation process since 10 years. That is the reason I had not been looking at FSB Pro anymore the last years and each time I did, I was simply missing that integral feature.

However, with EA Studio, things are a bit different now... it generates systems SO fast (if you are using an optimized Chrome build), that I was able to create ~15 million strategies on 60000 bars of data within just 18 hours last weekend (AMD Threadripper 1950X CPU). Out of that, I had about 1500 usable ones and then have cut those down to 100 "best ones". Then just exported them to a Portfolio EA and let them trade for one week on EURUSD. Up 280 Euro with 0.01 lots, amazing! That is a whole new approach to EA Studio and trading such a huge collection of strategies at once. Instead of baby-sitting and ultra-fine-tuning a few "elite" strategies then almost always lose their edge when going live, you throw hundreds of them at the market, knowing many of them will fail, but most likely 60% will not and hence exploiting the overall positive bias of all strategies combined to make profits. I will continue testing this approach the following week too. If this approach keeps on doing good, Popov will get a good share of the profits, that is for sure because this idea he had is so unique and was new to me as well after so many years of making a living in Forex.

So my summary: I´d go with SQ / Adaptrade Builder or the new GSB if you need custom fitness functions (and most "pro" traders simply do need that) and I´d go with EA Studio if you are going for Popov´s new approach and wanted strategies fast without wanting to fine-tune them in-depth like you could do with FSB Pro (which though lacks the custom fitness functions as well). Once EA Studio has a proper "stability" measure for the equity curves, things will also look much better in there once again, I think I would not even need custom fitness functions in there anymore then because of the sheer amount of strategies it can output so quickly (where SQ4 / Adaptrade / GSB are like 50x slower).

Keep up the good work Mr. Popov! Thanks so much :-)

14 (edited by rwsttra 2018-04-21 21:13:57)

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I bought GSB 1 year ago . To make a long story short, if you want to trade ES it
is good but for everything else it you will have more problems.   Custom fitness did
not give me much additional value. The problem with GSB is that the formula
it uses is quite fixed and this formula works well on ES but other tickers are
more difficult.
The skeleton of the formula is optimized for ES and even while there are 36 indicators
it doesn't matter much which ones you are enabling or disabling. It just finds small
trades on ES and it needs volatility. Till 2017 it worked great and after that,  decide
for yourself if you test. But there is an active forum with many experienced traders
and Peter is working hard to make things better. Currently robustness is a topic in the
GSB NG and there is progress. Their optimizer is a peak optimizer and even after
long WF checks systems can still fail OOS. The best optimizer should search for a stable
range of parameters which not has to be the peak. I understand FOREXSB is also a peak
optimizer.

GSB has  custom indicator now and that is what I am going to try in the near future.
I have not been able to generate good systems on Forex with GSB and I think it is not intended
for that. Peter also says he is not good in Forex.
GSB only has very simple exits (no trailing or ATR etc) , a lot of work still has to be done here.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

We have known that SQ was falling behind.

Marc is not into development of any of his products in recent months, seems he has other things to do.

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

16 (edited by geektrader 2018-04-23 05:17:06)

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

I´ll have to correct you on this one as this can´t be further from what´s really going on right now ;-) SQ4 is close to release and they´ve been working on it for near 2 years now. It´s been on public beta-test for almost a year now too (Beta 9 was released 3 days ago and I´ve been testing it the whole weekend + made new bug reports). I am not going to post any links out of respect, but have a look at their Forum or bug-tracker (love this method to track bugs) and you´ll see that there is MAD activity as the final release is nearing.

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

OOOOOOOOPs

I stand corrected....

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

All good, just was wondering how you came to this conclusion :-)

Re: Testing Strategy Builders after StrategyQuant

there seems to be nothing much with Quant Analyzer and the EA Wizard....

and emails sent to support are rarely answered.

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....