Topic: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer
Barometer (Definition): An instrument that measures how things are changing or likely to develop.

Here's a link to the web site for MT4 Sidekick: 
http://mt4tracker.com/mt4-sidekick/

Here's a link to the documentation:
http://mt4tracker.com/documentation/mt4-sidekick-documentation/

MT4 Sidekick is a new tool that uses a Demo Account to create a database of trade results that is shared with a Live Account. When a strategy in a Live Account receives a trade signal it checks the database to determine how that strategy is currently performing in the Demo Account. If the strategy is currently performing well in the Demo Account then a new position is opened in the Live Account — otherwise, the signal is ignored.

The idea is simple, two accounts — Demo and Live — running the same portfolios and strategies. The strategies in the Demo Account are allowed to trade with no restrictions and are used to create and update an active, shared database of trading results. When a strategy in the Live Account receives a signal it checks the database before opening a new position. In this way the Live Account can use the Demo Account as a barometer to determine how a strategy is performing in the current market. The availability of a barometer that measures current performance and which can be accessed before a position is opened is a powerful technique. A strategy’s performance will vary depending on patterns that occur in the current, incoming data — and the incoming data is always changing. So, taking advantage of a Demo Account in this way — i.e. as a "barometer" — opens up a new way of managing EAs and trades that can be used to your advantage to provide a real "edge".  You could even use a live "micro" account in place of the Demo Account, in which case the "barometer" would be even more accurate.

MT4 Sidekick requires Portfolio Maker (http://mt4tracker.com/portfolio-maker/) to combine individual FSB-Pro strategies into a portfolio EA. Portfolio Maker is required because it inserts code into the portfolio EA that knows how to access MT4 Sidekick's shared database.

MT4 Sidekick does not support EA Studio, but perhaps it will in a future version -- we'll see.

MT4 Sidekick isn't free, but it is inexpensive -- only $49 USD.

2 (edited by hannahis 2018-03-26 12:17:28)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

For your convenience, you can click on the link below to direct you to the website

Here's a link to the web site for MT4 Sidekick: 
http://mt4tracker.com/mt4-sidekick/


Here's a link to the documentation:
http://mt4tracker.com/documentation/mt4 … mentation/

PS: Where to find the download link?

3 (edited by Popov 2018-03-27 19:25:25)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

The download link is sent with the email that includes the license key.  If you already have a license key then you can use this download link:

Edit: link to exe removed.

4 (edited by Popov 2018-03-27 19:25:13)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Thanks

For the Download Link

Edit: link to exe removed.

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

There could be two instances of Sidekick in the case of more than 5 demo accounts?  assuming more than one real account?

All of the controls you have installed in the Portfolio Tool and Sidekick make a huge beneficial change in portfolio management. You have removed a lot of the drudgery and sweat work.

Thanks a lot , Steve!

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Each Demo account is a "producer" -- since it creates a database.  The name of the database is the Demo Account's number.
Each Real account is a "consumer" -- since it reads a database.

One of the input parameters to the portfolio EA (created by Portfolio Maker) running in a Real Account is the name of the database to use (i.e. which Demo Account to use as the barometer).

So -- there is an unlimited number of combinations.  You can use any database with any Real account.

The software license key allows you to install MT4 Sidekick on up to 3 machines -- each machine can be running multiple MT4 terminal sessions.  If you are using more than 3 machines then I'm happy to send additional licenses.

7 (edited by hannahis 2018-04-02 10:08:59)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

sleytus wrote:

Hello Hannah,

Trading the top 10 or 50 breaks from the "barometer" behavior that I think makes Sidekick a unique and powerful tool.  The top 10 or 50 strategies are determined from historical stats.  You can use MT4 Tracker to prune a portfolio for the best strategies.

I think it was you who pointed out in a previous post there really is no such thing as a bad strategy.  And that stuck with me and I think it is true.  Strategies perform differently depending on the current data stream.  How a strategy performed the past month does not guarantee how it will perform in the coming month.

The purpose of Sidekick is to provide a "barometer" of how a strategy is performing NOW.  It is mostly based on observations that strategies frequently exhibit consecutive streaks of wins and losses.  MT4 Strategy Tester even includes the metrics "Average Consecutive Wins" and "Average Consecutive Losses" -- so even MetaQuotes has noticed this.  As a side note -- it is interesting to me that no one ever takes advantage of that observation, as far as I can tell.

With Sidekick, I don't care how a strategy traded in the past -- i.e. maybe it performed great or maybe it performed poorly.  All I care about is how it is performing NOW.  And using a Demo Account (or a Real micro account) to create a shared database that the Live Account can use provides a real "edge" -- at least, that is what I'm finding.


Hi Steve,

The purpose of Sidekick is to provide a "barometer" of how a strategy is performing NOW.  But your NOW is still based on past performance statistics (most recent 10 trades, which is PAST (not now) 10 trades) such as whether the strategy has meet certain level of min consecutive win etc.

So how do you know what's your strategy NOW performance? It's from PAST statistics.  So there is no such thing as NOW or Past cos the Top 10 EA list is also the NOW performance, the list contains currently (NOW) those EA that are in the Top 10 performance.  So it's also the "NOW" performance.  Using Top 10 (or whatever number) criteria is a more versatile metric cos different EA has different ave consecutive win/loss or different win/loss ratio and hence it's tough to use a blanket rule for different EA.  Cos I want to diversify my portfolio using scalper EA and intraday EA etc, so having a "blanket" rule won't be suitable for me. 

But using Top 10 EA, I'm trading with "diverse" types of EA as long as they make money to get to the top 10 list.  So EA that started to decline will then drop off from the Top 10 list and hence, this list is dynamic and current (now).

I hope you will kindly consider such option.  However I  understand you are in no obligation to do it since it's your project and you have every right to consider what you deem best and you have your own busy schedule.

8 (edited by sleytus 2018-04-02 11:30:39)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Hello Hannah,

Yes -- technically -- you are correct. 

My "NOW" is based on an observation that many strategies trade in streaks -- e.g. 5, 10, 20 wins or losses in a row.  So, when I suggest a policy of "2 consecutive wins" then there is a good chance the strategy is currently working on a chunk of data where it recognizes the patterns.  That's what I mean by NOW.  Even using a WinRatio from the most recent 10 trades, it also is sort of NOW when compared to back testing statistics that rely on a data horizon of years and hundreds or thousands of trades.  So, when I use NOW it is a relative NOW -- i.e. based on the most recent results from a Demo Account.

The problem with trying to rank the top 10 is what metric or criteria are you going to use?  Also, using the most recent 10 trades is not sufficient to compute meaningful statistics.

Rather than try to force the software to fit to what you want, please consider what I've written here and on the web site that describes Sidekick.  Sidekick is different, it's simple, and it works.  No one else has done this before or even proposed it.  If you are determined to rank strategies then please use MT4 Tracker -- that's what it is good at.  Sidekick is not intended to rank strategies.

Again -- Sidekick acts like a barometer in that it keeps track how strategies are currently performing in a Demo Account.  The underlying assumption is strategies perform well when they recognize patterns in the current data stream and perform poorly when they don't recognize patterns in the current data stream.  Since market conditions change then sometimes strategies perform well and sometimes they don't.  Sidekick is intended to give your Real account a clue as to which strategies are currently trading well in a Demo Account.

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

I see what you mean by 'current'. The backtest or optimization is based on old data that does not reflect properly the current phase of the market.

I think we have to reoptimize on a regular frequent basis to stay current..... or a good strategy will be placed on the shelf.

NOW, at last, I am starting to grasp some other ideas you have mentioned hahaha (dumb old geezer has bright light turned on lol)

Using this approach would allow someone to trade on a much more accurate basis using fewer bars in backtest as long as optimization is current, I think. (Wow, after you mention an idea, I grasp it within 6 months or a year, cut that down to three months if I take my pills).

I see, now, why you would like to revise the optimizer.

This is great!!

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Another question, sorry.

In the case of a new strategy with no trading experience....  how will that be handled......

Does the new strategy have to have a few demo trades before placing in real account.?

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Blaiserboy wrote:

Does the new strategy have to have a few demo trades before placing in real account.?

Good question -- you catch on quick...

Short Answer:
No.  You can place the portfolio EA in a Real account at any time.

Long Answer:
Let's say you create a portfolio EA with 60 strategies.  You would then add it to both the Demo and Real accounts.  The Demo account is responsible for creating and maintaining the database.  Furthermore, your strategies trade unrestricted in the Demo account.  Back in the Real account, the strategies lay dormant until the policy condition has been met.

For example, let's say the policy is "2 consecutive wins".  That means a strategy remains dormant in the Real account until there are 2 consecutive wins in the Demo account.  After 2 consecutive wins in the Demo account, the next time there is a signal in the Real account then the strategy will open a new position.  If the strategy loses a trade in the Demo account then consecutive wins is set to '0' and it remains dormant in the Real account until the next time there are 2 consecutive wins (in the Demo account).

There are two main policies:  Consecutive Wins and WinRatio (most recent 10 trades).  So, if you don't like the idea of consecutive wins then you can instead use WinRatio.

An additional detail about WinRatio -- if there are 0 trades, then the initial WinRatio is set to 0.51.  The consequence of this is if you are using a policy with a WinRatio of 0.5 and if a signal first appears in the Real account then it will open a position.  In other words, you would use this if you want your strategy to begin trading right away in the Real account and don't want to wait for consecutive wins.

Using the "N consecutive wins" policy means the strategy lays dormant in the Real account until N consecutive wins occurs in the Demo account.  I mostly trade H1, so it can take a few days or a few weeks before certain strategies begin to trade.  But that's not a problem for me because, collectively, my portfolio EAs include 100's of strategies.

An additional benefit -- you no longer have to worry about pruning bad strategies from a portfolio.  If a strategy doesn't meet the conditions of the policy then it simply lays dormant.

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Wow, you have really developed a huge advantage for users of FSBPro.

The more I think about this, the more I can see the development of more effective stratgeies, as well as quicker and more sustainable profits.

Thanks for that explanation....., now, instead of dreaming about cooking a nice meal for supper I can imagine great profits from FSBPro..

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Thanks, Blaiserboy,

Yes -- thanks to Popov's amazing software, I think Sidekick can make a significant impact on how we trade portfolio EAs with hundreds or thousands of strategies.  Only a small subset of strategies are active at any time -- the ones that are currently trading well in the Demo (or Real micro) account. 

Also, this could impact the way we optimize and back test strategies.  For example, EURUSD / H1:
It is counter-productive to use 200,000 (or even 20,000) bars for generating / optimizing.  In the case of H1, I routinely use 4000 bars (approximately 8 months).  Not only is this much faster, but also the statistics are much better. 

The goal is to train strategies to recognize patterns and, so, it makes sense that more bars is better.  But this comes at the expense that it is more difficult to fit your algebraic formula (i.e. the strategy) to the data, and the statistics are poor.  So, instead of using 20,000 bars it is better to divide that data horizon into 5 smaller data horizons (4000 bars each) and create 5 strategies.  These 5 strategies share the same indicators, but because the indicator constants are different then they are really 5 different strategies.  They each will have good statistics for certain chunks of data and patterns.

So, now you add the 5 strategies to your portfolio EA and use Sidekick.  At any one time, only one strategy is actually trading (the one that likes the current data) and the other 4 remain dormant until they see a chunk of data that they like.

Blaiserboy -- I know you understand this since you were the one who last year posted a comment that turned on a light bulb in my brain -- to think of strategies as mathematical formulas.  And as a software developer that's exactly how they are implemented.  I'm mostly elaborating in case others are interested.

Sorry to spoil your dinner plans -- did you have to settle for "Cup-of-Noodles"?

14 (edited by GD 2018-04-03 08:50:57)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

What about to add the possibility ON-OFF with a custom indicator in a demo chart except w/l ratio etc which will give 0 or I to Stop or Start EA.
Then you have it...

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Portfolio EAs (and their strategies) trade unrestricted in the Demo Account -- always.  The Demo Account is used to create a shared database.  The database is used by a Real Account.

The same portfolio EAs and strategies are running in both the Demo and Real Accounts.  When a strategy in the Real Account generates a signal it checks the database to determine whether or not to open a new position.  If the strategy meets the policy condition (e.g. 2 consecutive wins in the Demo Account) then it will open a new position in the Real Account.  Otherwise, the signal in the Real Account is ignored.

The Demo and Real Accounts can have multiple portfolio EAs and hundreds or thousands of strategies.  Adding another indicator will not solve anything.

Again -- the purpose of the Demo Account is to serve as a barometer.  It lets the corresponding strategies in the Real Account know how that same strategy is currently trading in the Demo Account.

16

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

There is an indicator named History Chart indicator.
This indicator in combination with another one can be used and give a customized signal.

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

GD wrote:

There is an indicator named History Chart indicator.
This indicator in combination with another one can be used and give a customized signal.


Hi GD,

Can you explain further about this History Chart indicator and where to locate this indicator (in FSB?)

Thanks
Hannah

18 (edited by GD 2018-04-03 16:34:55)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Hi Hannah

This indicator is an MT4 indicator I found freely. It can be loaded in chart with any running EA as indicator and run all the time and show the curves FSB shows (balance and equity of account). I believe easily can be changed and be used for specific magic number or portfolio or together with a logic inside FSBpro. This is the first suggestion.

In combination of this indicator with other indicators which user can decide, it can be used as ON or OFF together with existed rules Sleytus has in his software. The user in Real account with sidekick can decide which rule to use. The software of Sleytus this way can for more general use.

For this reason I suggested Sleytus to permit the use also to Demo Sidekick of a custom ON/OFF indicator with specific format ofcourse or rule of name etc.

This proposal can give extreme power to Sidekick, as other posibilities selected by user can be used. It will be actually the first commercial of its kind.

19 (edited by sleytus 2018-04-03 17:06:48)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

There is an indicator named History Chart indicator.

I'm familiar with the History Chart indicator.  It is a nice indicator that displays account information.  MT4 Sidekick also collects account information -- that is how it creates and updates a shared database.

To be honest, I'm not interested in making Sidekick more complex.  By the time you add your portfolio EA (and strategies) to an account we are done with statistics.  The fact the strategy survived your testing and was added to your portfolio means it is a quality strategy.  There is no need to continue torturing it.  The only thing that matters now is whether or not the strategy wins or loses.  If it is currently winning then you want it to open new positions.  If it is not winning then you want it to lie dormant until market conditions change and it likes the incoming data and can successfully recognize patterns.

The idea really is quite simple -- it doesn't need to be made more complicated.  No more stats...

20

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

I can accept any idea if it works...

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

I do not do well with a lot of stats and analysis, too confusing for the brain that has misfunctioned with onsetting dementia.

This SideKick is making things quite to my liking as it diminishes the decision making.

I have no problem running the generator and developing different strategies, however gathering statistics for analysis does not work well.

There can be a lot of stress associated with trading, as well as a lot of time involvement. Simplification, to me, is really beneficial.

Popov's project, to develop his products for us, have greatly reduced time involvement and stress. For that I am really grateful.

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

22 (edited by sleytus 2018-04-03 21:28:34)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Hannah, GD -- please understand I am not trying to push the software.  I'm simply trying to explain what it does and the philosophy behind it.  And I'm sharing the software with you -- yes, it costs $49, but that is essentially free (since it turns out if you don't charge something then no one takes it seriously). 

Neither of you understand how Sidekick works, let alone tried using it.  Yet, you already have suggestions for how it could be modified.  Furthermore, your suggestions aren't minor improvements here and there but, rather, rewriting it to suit your particular preferences.  As a general rule it is not a good idea to use a tool if you don't understand how it works or disagree with its philosophy.  I don't mean to be rude, but to save you both time I would suggest Sidekick is not for you (or anyone who is more concerned about statistics than how a strategy is trading NOW).

23 (edited by hannahis 2018-04-03 21:43:18)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Dear Steve,

My apologies if my suggestions or feedback is deem as disrespectful to you.


I did think of how I can use Side Kick, however as I mentioned before in my previous post, I've a diversified portfolio and hence it's very difficult for me to apply a "blanket" rule such as min 2 consecutive win etc, unless I have to go through the trouble to identify each EA, which market it belongs (or in sync with) to separate them into different groups to apply different rules but I thot the purpose of Side Kick to have a "suitable" filter to do away from manual selection.

Hence, I thought it was out of respect that I give you my feedback as a potential end user the difficulties I face in trying to implement Side Kick into my portfolio.  Thus my intention is not to side track your goal for Side Kick but to give added perspectives of how other traders may encounter in their process of wanting to implement Side Kick, etc.

Kindly then ignore all my feedback if you deem it as any sign of "disapproval" or negativity. 

Cos You are one of the few person here in the forum that I deeply respect and hence it's never my intention to cause you any grief.

You are one of the few person who ever "advance" FSB users' EA development and speed up our processes.  No amount of words could utter my deep sense of gratitude to what you have done to the community and hence, I will thus refrain myself from commenting or add suggestions to your projects as I don't want you to misunderstand it as a sign of disapproval or disrespect towards you.

Thanks once again for coming up with so many complementary software that really adds value to our trading experience tremendously.

Best Regards
Hannah

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

The 'Data Horizon' tool in 'Market' is gonna get a lot more valuable as weeks pass, changing time periods to get different patterns.

This approach opens up so much.

I had been using the date changes, mainly for walk forward..... and missing a ton of opportunities.....

Steve.... this thing is sorta mind blowing!

My 'secret' goal is to push EA Studio until I can net 3000 pips per day....

25 (edited by sleytus 2018-04-04 01:34:33)

Re: MT4 Sidekick - Demo Account Barometer

Blaiserboy wrote:

The 'Data Horizon' tool in 'Market' is gonna get a lot more valuable as weeks pass, changing time periods to get different patterns.

Yep -- good point. Starting with a known, good strategy, I'll make several clones and use a different Data Horizon for each one.  Even though they share the same indicators, since parameters will be different then it is roughly equivalent to generating new strategies from scratch -- since they each are optimized to recognize different patterns.

When you combine this approach with Sidekick, then only those strategies that recognize patterns in the current data stream (i.e. current market conditions) are allowed to trade and the others remain dormant.  And as market conditions change then different strategies wake up and others go to sleep.